Hard cold start - possibly down on power - help!

[fen]

Well the woes continue. Since i did the valves the other week I figured I'd try a compression test. I picked up a Maddox kit from HF that seemed okay.
I'm at 2700 ft, had the engine warmed up, all of the plugs removed, good battery. I did not remove the air cleaner.

Compression Test video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jn-Lgf6CiOk

Results:
#1 ~370
#2 ~400
#3 ~370
#4 ~350

Manual says anything under 390 is rebuild territory. I'm guessing unscrupulous starting fluid use at this point.

I did notice some oil on the glow plugs especially #1 cylinder.

Glow plug oil residue?

Current symptoms:

• Hard cold start

• Excessive white smoke at idle from vent tube and exhaust (about equal)

• Dark grey / black smoke when accelerating hard(er) / up hill.

• Poor fuel economy. I'll need to do more testing here but seems to be in the 20mpg area doing lots of idling, city driving, and working on fuel system though.

• Ticking sound following rpms especially when giving throttle?

I might still have the injectors checked, as I guess it can't hurt. Pup probably needs all the help starting it can get. I've read some threads about a poor starter / solenoid causing hard starts, which I assume could also cause low compression results. But I think my starter sounded okay.

Would a stick on oil pan heater or block heater help? I don't have a block heater installed but figure I might try a stick on heater since it starts okay after the initial cold start.

I'm not sure what a rebuild to get the compression back up would entail, valve stem seals? Piston rings? Pistons? Do they need to be oversized? Are parts / rebuild kits available to overhaul the engine or would perhaps better to find a used replacement engine with good compression if possible and swap it?

[fen]

I’m hoping I found the source of the air in the lines. Got around to replacing the intake and return lines at the tank. Intake line looked terrible. When I pulled it off the ends were all cracked inside. Didn’t notice anymore bubbles after driving around a bit and replacing. We’ll see if that was adding to hard starts or not.

Jet of bubbles in intake line before IP

Cracked intake line 1

Cracked intake line 2

[fen]

No air leaks, still very hard to start.

Going to try a stick on oil pan heater if it helps at all.
Scheduled to get the injectors looked at next week. This quote seemed to say it should start okay with lower compression so hoping that helps. I’m struggling to start even at 70 degrees now. Filled up last night was 20.5 mpgs.

ive seen numbers from 260s all the way to 430s

when there all 400+ you got a good one.

375 for an avrege or higher OK, but going to struggle to start in temps under 25F.

get down to 350 and under for an average it will be hard to start in cold temps WITH GOOD GLOWS

300 and under you need a top notch BAT and glows to get it started in the cold....
let alone the hp will be 50% under the OE numbers or worse.....so MPG will suffer a good bit..

[fen]

I’ll try holding key to start with clutch out next cold start a lot longer and see if that helps or not.

All I could see from my notes was that I had tried holding the key to start for 15 seconds, which was not long enough.

I was having a bear of a time getting it started the other day, 60 degrees out.
Finally I tried the key to start for ~30 seconds after the initial relay went off and that really seemed to help and it fired up after just a couple seconds of cranking and giving it throttle.

Sending the injectors out to be worked over so should know back in about a week if that helps.

[Dieselsmoke69]

Any updates? Not hijacking you..Im having the same exact issue! Has ran great last 4 years..Rebuilt the entire top end! New guides, seats, valves head gasket, brand new c240 rocker arm assembly. Brand new glow plugs new Bosh Nozzles set at 1600. And All because of the original issue! Very hard to start. One day after a hwy run it just refused to start easily. I have it running on a quart of seafoam with a 3 pound gear pump. Return was clogged on mine as well. No help still very hard to start . Glow plugs are fine and timing is where i put it 4 years ago dead on. Played with the csd shims as well as cleaned it and checked timing piston for travel. Im stumped and ready to scream. At this point i have a used pump i may try.... but it's sat in a field itself for years. If i had $650 to rebuild one id have grocery money. What the hell even goes bad in these rotary pumps besides the rubber seals and gaskets? Do the rubber dampners inside the pump wear retarding the timing? Is it the plunger assembly going bad. Can i just advance the pump and set my pop pressure higher. Im stumped and ive been here since the old testament was written by the greasy old soot fart himself.

[Dieselsmoke69]

Any updates? Not hijacking you..Im having the same exact issue! Has ran great last 4 years..Rebuilt the entire top end! New guides, seats, valves head gasket, brand new c240 rocker arm assembly. Brand new glow plugs new Bosh Nozzles set at 1600. And All because of the original issue! Very hard to start. One day after a hwy run it just refused to start easily. I have it running on a quart of seafoam with a 3 pound gear pump. Return was clogged on mine as well. No help still very hard to start . Glow plugs are fine and timing is where i put it 4 years ago dead on. Played with the csd shims as well as cleaned it and checked timing piston for travel. Im stumped and ready to scream. At this point i have a used pump i may try.... but it's sat in a field itself for years. If i had $650 to rebuild one id have grocery money. What the hell even goes bad in these rotary pumps besides the rubber seals and gaskets? Do the rubber dampners inside the pump wear retarding the timing? Is it the plunger assembly going bad. Can i just advance the pump and set my pop pressure higher. Im stumped and ive been here since the old testament was written by the greasy old soot fart himself. Well...i found my injection pump shaft seal is leaking and apparently cavitating the pump.

[fen]

I am still waiting on injector rebuild.

I did find that if I held the key to start with the clutch out for 30 seconds after the initial glow plug cycle it started up when cold okay. Does this help you?

The CSD leaking shouldn't affect cold start, but would if it's removed. My CSD was leaking and it had reduced power. That cleared up with a new seal kit for the CSD.

I also fixed a leak on the fuel adjustment screw. I did change a fuel filter and ran some ATF through it. I've ran seafoam too. Not sure if one of those things contributed to making it harder to start.

A decade ago I had LOT of rust in the tank mucking up my filter. And the static timing is definitely just a guesstimate.


Check:
Is fuel reaching Injectors when cranking?
IP timing / timing alignment,
Glow plug system,
Injectors,
Valve clearance,
Compression test.

If all of these are good then probably service Injection Pump.

[fen]

Well just tried to start with new injectors, same problem.
Cranks but doesn’t fire when cold after normal glow plug cycle. Hold key to start with clutch out for 30 seconds and fires up. I can’t think of anything else other than checking the static timing again or having pump rebuilt.


Could this be a bad IP?

Should I try to find the dial gauge to set the static timing first and see if that helps?

Think this dial gauge would work for it?
https://www.ewktool.com/products/eb0013 ... g-tool-kit

[Dieselsmoke69]

Heres my thought. Yes the I/P probably is due for a rebuild. If youve replaced leaking CSD seals...the other seals are not far behind inside the pump. Heres what happens. Our engines, unless rebuilt are worn and typically lower on compression than they were 42 years ago. A diesel needs compression in order to start and run properly. So now it becomes critical for theses systems to work as any problem with the glow plug system or fuel injection will show up immediately on a cold start. This is any diesel on earth. I accidentally ordered 12 volt glow plugs . I found this after rebuilding the entire top end, valvetrain and replacing the injector pump and injector nozzles. I was glad i did too as it all was bad. Along with the crispy fuel lines in the engine bay and at the fuel tank. The fuel filter primer housing is also notorious for going bad. "Another rubber part in the fuel system" . I replaced mine with a standard 1" NPT generic cat filter housing from amazon. Now i can run almost any wix filter i choose instead of the $37 stock unit. Replace all your fuel lines if you havent. But i cannot emphasize enough make sure your glow plugs are the correct type and working correctly with the QOS system. The c223 uses 5 volt plugs on a 12 volt system. Its ingenious how they operate for quicker starting by momentarily giving the 5 volt plugs12 volts however when you have a hard start situation i could see where its easier to burn them up as well. Some, as i may do soon myself, just put in 12 volt glow plugs, which were used in the c190 or c240 isuzu reefer engines hooked to a generic ford starter solenoid with a push button on the dash. If the glow system and fuel injection is good, this motor will start up and run with 3 blown cylinders.

[fen]

So I finally got to this, unfortunately the nut holding the IP on the flange was all rounded so was pain to loosen up. Anyhow... I got the dial gauge and thought I followed the instructions well but I must have screwed something up. I'm thinking the first step with the gauge where the manual says to set to 1 mm (0.04 in). I'm not sure what that meant so might be what I did wrong.

Here was my process:

Rotate crank to TDC
Install Gauge
Rotate crank counter clockwise to about 45-60 degrees BTDC - to the point where the dial gauge stops moving.
Set the dial gauge to 0.
Rotate crank clockwise to the 15 degree BTDC mark. For this I used the second mark next to the TDC mark on the pully.
Loosen IP and rotate it until the gauge read 0.5. I had to rotate it a lot and it was very far advanced (aways from the engine).

Unfortunately this was way off. The engine was hard to start, very smokey, running hot, low power, and sounded like it was 'cutting out' while driving in 2nd / 3rd gear.

While the engine was running I loosened the IP back up and set it back where it 'sounded good'. About where it naturally wanted to be. Sounded and ran much better, not running hot, less smoke, better power. Still need to hold the glow plugs for about 30 second to get it to start at ~38 degrees today.

I'll have to try setting the static timing again since I clearly messed something up.

But I still am seeing some air bubbles in the clear lines I installed. It's not causing any noticeable performance issues or stumbling though. I think there's one rubber line at the tank I still need to replace... otherwise, I'm thinking it's time to pull the IP and send it in for a rebuild?

The other thing, definitely pretty smokey still and a fair amount of blow-by, so I'm sure the engine is in need of rebuild.

One thing at a time I suppose.

[fen]

Well I got the static timing set right. It was a little tricky and as always, helps to follow the directions precisely.

The instructions say to set the lift to 1mm. The dial gauge has a smaller gauge in the middle, when you install the gauge into the IP install it so that the gauge hits 1mm on the smaller gauge at first.

See my video here for the full process including what I did wrong:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JoZB2w_uRmA



Unfortunately, while definitely an improvement, it's still hard to start cold. It did start with a 30 second low glow plug cycle, but took some pumping of the pedal to get it going: watch here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=coOK2Gk64eQ

[Halden]

Have you had your spray pattern checked yet?

[fen]

Have you had your spray pattern checked yet?

I had the nozzles replaced earlier.

There's either, or a combination of:
1. some kind of air leak still (I think I need to check/replace the filler tube line at the tank)
2. IP problem
3. Low compression

[fen]

Installed block heater, plugged in for a couple hours and truck starts up almost right away with a normal glow plug cycle at 32 degrees.

[Halden]

How good is your compression? It seems like you've got your timing dialed in, and the CSD defaults to advancing the timing, unless somehow it's stuck off which would be unusual... Have you checked your valve lash? That can have a huge impact. Especially if you don't compensate for the wear on the rockers. Even my truck with crappy compression at altitude starts relatively easily in the winter, and I got rid of the CSD on it.