1.8 Diesel upgrades

This is the place to discuss DIESEL engine modifications.
bthood
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Isuzu vehicle(s): 1982 Isuzu I-mark engine 1.8 liter diesel, 1987 PUP

1.8 Diesel upgrades

Post by bthood »

I wonder how much boost a 1.8 Imark diesel motor could take? I mean I'm not trying to race with it or drift but a little bit more power would be nice. Ive heard it said that A 2.2 turbo diesel requires heavier rods than a regular 2.2 diesel but the 1.8's were turbo ready with the stock set up.
Dieselsmoke69
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Re: 1.8 Diesel upgrades

Post by Dieselsmoke69 »

I believe i read a similar thread either here or on another isuzu site touching on the same subject inquiring about a turbo on the 1.8 diesel. Not sure of the consensus but if my memory serves any use anymore i think it was said you may end up with the power of a stock normally aspirated c223. All of the rod failures ive heard of in the c223 engines were with the turbo rods. I have yet to hear of a normally aspirated 2.2 that was later turboed break a rod. Mind you that may be because not as many guys have went thru the trouble to turbo a stock engine as there were turbo c223 engines out there to begin with. I say do your homework and dare to be different. Toss a small garrett t15 on there and send it. Anything bigger will probably have a hard time spooling. I am personally putting a turbo on my stock c223 rods but i am sending them out for cyro treatment as insurance. Spending thousands on a rebuild is not something i intend on or have the finances to do over again. So i highly recommend having the rods cyro treated if your going to rebuild it for added strength. Its not that expensive. A blown engine however is.To each his own. I say go for it.Wish i could offer more.
bthood
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Re: 1.8 Diesel upgrades

Post by bthood »

What is this “cyro “ treatment that you speak of?
bthood
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Re: 1.8 Diesel upgrades

Post by bthood »

If I take a crankshaft from the engine, shouldn’t I have it polished (assuming that it doesn’t need to be turned). If I polish it and it’s ok, shouldn’t I put new main and rod bearing in it? Assuming that I do all of this, if I pull the pistons, shouldn’t I put new rings on them? Is a C223 a sleeved engine or is it like a gas engine with a bored block? I’ve never torn down a diesel before. If I could figure a way to increase the power for a C223 to handle the added weight of an additional 800 lbs, I’d consider trying a turbo system on it. If I were to add a turbo, I know I’d need a new exhaust manifold. What about the intake? Does it use the same intake as a regular C223? What else would I need? Is there a “mild” turbo kit that anyone has used before from eBay? I don’t want to race it or do doughnuts/ drift. I don’t expect to “win” any races but I’d like to be able to put a spare C223 into a 4 dr Ford Ranger body that I have. It a little bit heavier than a pup and I’m afraid that the added weight would make the small C223 too small to pull the truck out of the driveway. Also, I’m cheap. I could try to find a 4BT Cummins but they seem to be from $4000 to $6000 dollars depending on how many miles the engine has. Additionally, I’d have to find a suitable transmission for a 4BT. There again, I’ve got a spare C223 with a 5 speed attached. I’m all for using what I’ve got as opposed to buying something new. Any thought or suggestions?
Brian
Dieselsmoke69
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Isuzu vehicle(s): 1982 CHEVY LUV MIKADO C223 DIESEL 2wd,1981 Chevy Luv shortbed 2wd G180Z, 1981 Chevy Luv Mikado 4x4 G180Z redline weber 32/36

Re: 1.8 Diesel upgrades

Post by Dieselsmoke69 »

The c223 as sold in the us is not sleeved. As far as the 1.8 i am not sure about without looking it up. My first and simplest suggestion would be to rebuild the 1.8 and drop it back in. If you want fast drop a v8 in it. These trucks were never fast.And None of these things are cheap either. Cryrogenic treatment is a process in which parts are brought to 300 below zero in a controlled environment for a set period of time. It alters the grain structure of the metal and can increase lifespan and strength many times over non treated parts. It takes thousands not hundreds of dollars to rebuild an engine correctly along time know how and patience. I might be interested in the c223 and tranny if you decide to sell them. The second option is to drop the c223 in there with the tranny. But your still going to have to change alot including the driveshafts fuel system and mounts and only marginally gain horsepower. Third option is to find a g series engine and tranny. I would concentrate on learning how to make uour original 1.8 diesel run as best it can and enjoy the truck the way it is rather than trying to outrun your friends. Its a classic vehicle not a race car just my opinion. But if youve got a thick wallet i can direct you to the guys over at holden gemini and set you up with some horsepower. If you transplant in a ls v8 now your talking a different rear end and brakes that can actually hold all the horsepower. Youll explode the stock rear end in no time flat.Just make sure you have the county coroner on speed dial. These are nice vehicles in there own right just the way they were designed. Thats why it still runs today my friend and why i own several myself
bthood
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Re: 1.8 Diesel upgrades

Post by bthood »

I think your missing what I’m trying to say, I’m not interested in going fast or racing. If I was, a diesel is not the way I’d go. I’m not hacking a rare or classic vehicle, it’s a 2002 Ford that has a bad power train in it. I have two spare Diesel engines. I have a running 1.8 and a core C233 non Turbo. I want to do a diesel swap. I am wanting to compensate for the weight difference between the original pup weight v the heavier Ford weight. I am concerned that since the Diesel engine was designed for the lighter pup, that the diesel would dramatically under perform In The heavier Ford body. Like I said, I’m not looking for fast, I’m looking to have a power train that will handle the heavier load of the additional weight. If the 1.8 with a turbo would work, then I would go that way. On The other hand, if the C223 rebuilt with a turbo (assuming that the bottom end would handle the turbo) would be a better route to take, then I’d go that way. I am assuming that since a C223 was used in a Trooper (which should be about the same weight as a 4 dr Ranger) I’m guess that, while it won’t be the cheapest route to take, that the C223 would probably be the better performer than the 1.8 diesel. How much does the “cryo” treatment cost and where can I get this done?
bthood
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Re: 1.8 Diesel upgrades

Post by bthood »

Did a trooper ever come with a non turbo C223?
Dieselsmoke69
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Re: 1.8 Diesel upgrades

Post by Dieselsmoke69 »

Ok, yes i believe either engine would be a slug in the heavier truck. If ....those were my only choices id say go with the c223. If its a ranger id say go for it but it depends on your gvw gearing and tire size among other things its still likely going to have a hard time getting out of its own way. You could go with a VW 1.9 TDI diesel as ive seen guys squeeze some very serious power out of those things but youll need the ecu harness and gas pedal as its a drive by wire design. And theres alot more parts available and aftermarket support for them. Then theres the venerable old school mercedes 5 cylinder diesel as well. Isuzu also makes several other turbo diesels such as the 4jb1 that would be more beneficial in the tourqe and power department. You can get them imported used and running engines thru Alibaba..... if you manage to get one here before WW3 breaks out and China invades us. The stock NA c223 will take a turbo all day at low boost of 13-15lbs from what i gathered. But the rods are apparently the weak spot. There were 3 different versions of the factory rods because they kept breaking them on the turbo engines. However interesting enough i havent heard of guys snapping the n/a rods yet with a turbo.The issue is the c223 has a high 21 to 1 compression ratio . So unless you shave the pistons to knock the CR down a bit you dont want to run alot of boost on one "although it has been done before." Do a Google search on cyrogenic processing. I was planning on using performance metals or 300 below. Performance metals has a price list. For what the treatment does its worth every cent. And getting a set of these rods cyroed for less than $150 is a incredible deal. Im having my rods cam pusrods valve springs keepers and retainers cyroed. Not because im building a race engine but because i want it to outlast me that and im adding a turbo. There are computer programs you can use to enter all of your specs to figure out exactly what your wanting to know from horsepower torque tire size and gear ratios. If i had to go back and do over id run A vw TDI with an adapter on a toyota trans and still have less in it and alot more power than the c223. But the truck will be kept original now and i have 2 other trucks out back if i decide to do that next time around.
bthood
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Re: 1.8 Diesel upgrades

Post by bthood »

Thanks.
FiatSpider2
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Re: 1.8 Diesel upgrades

Post by FiatSpider2 »

Not sure about the C233 however the 4FB1 usually came with the IP already setup with the valve to compensate for boost pressure from a turbo.

I have the 4FB1 in a Fiat 124 Spider which has a small IHI V1.1 Spec RHB51 4954 turbo charger in it. Its reasonably peppy and I do tow a small utility trailer or a picnic sail boat with it and even with the 500 lb boat or a half ton in the utility trailer the turbo spools up and pulls the extra weight extremely well while delivering fuel economy in the low to mid 30 MPG range around town while without the trailers it will be mid/upper 30 to 40 MPG range around town. The 4FB1 design was explained to me to have been designed from the ground up to be turbo charged from the trussing of the block to type of connecting rods they installed at the factory. The cross flow head and overhead cam design along with higher rpm capabilities are a plus too.

Purists won't like the simple and compact intake manifold made out of a straight piece of box tubing bolted flat to the side of the head with the turbo charger bolted to the other side of it however its extremely compact and was needed to fit the engine compartment plus its not set up for extreme amounts of boost so it works well for the application.

To be fair the Spider does have a 4:10 diff in it with 165/75-13 tires on it setup for the original 7,500 rpm gas engine so it pulls like a tractor with the diesel and may even tempt you to start off in second gear at times.
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DieselJeep
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Re: 1.8 Diesel upgrades

Post by DieselJeep »

Jerry THE MAN LEMOND sez they should handle 10PSI(if I recall the conversation accurately) just fine.

I haven't played with mine much at all and am only measuring @ 4psi before I have to get out of it. It's absurd how it loves boost.

The 4FB1 is a completely different motor when it's operating with boost. Like Isuzu designed it originally.

Fiat, not all 4fb1 IP's came with the "altitude compensator". The one I am using is a "turned up" "flat top" Ip cover.
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Dieselsmoke69
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Re: 1.8 Diesel upgrades

Post by Dieselsmoke69 »

Dude that is way cool! Now if thats not inspiration im not sure what is. What kind of fuel filter housing is that? And what tranny is it bolted too. Nice
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Re: 1.8 Diesel upgrades

Post by FiatSpider2 »

DieselJeep wrote:
Wed Jun 16, 2021 7:11 pm
Jerry THE MAN LEMOND sez they should handle 10PSI(if I recall the conversation accurately) just fine.

I haven't played with mine much at all and am only measuring @ 4psi before I have to get out of it. It's absurd how it loves boost.

The 4FB1 is a completely different motor when it's operating with boost. Like Isuzu designed it originally.

Fiat, not all 4fb1 IP's came with the "altitude compensator". The one I am using is a "turned up" "flat top" Ip cover.
I was told the compensator came by default on the General Motors vehicles with the 4F1B but not the I-Mark. Not sure about the Impulse since it was a Sports Coupe. I do not believe the 4F1Bs that came in pumps, generators, industrial or farm equipment had the turbo compensator either.
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Re: 1.8 Diesel upgrades

Post by Halden »

FiatSpider2 wrote:
Sun Jun 20, 2021 6:15 am
DieselJeep wrote:
Wed Jun 16, 2021 7:11 pm
Jerry THE MAN LEMOND sez they should handle 10PSI(if I recall the conversation accurately) just fine.

I haven't played with mine much at all and am only measuring @ 4psi before I have to get out of it. It's absurd how it loves boost.

The 4FB1 is a completely different motor when it's operating with boost. Like Isuzu designed it originally.

Fiat, not all 4fb1 IP's came with the "altitude compensator". The one I am using is a "turned up" "flat top" Ip cover.
I was told the compensator came by default on the General Motors vehicles with the 4F1B but not the I-Mark. Not sure about the Impulse since it was a Sports Coupe. I do not believe the 4F1Bs that came in pumps, generators, industrial or farm equipment had the turbo compensator either.
As far as I know the pumps on the chevettes didn't have an aneroid/altitude compensator, but the I-marks did. On NA engines it was a barometric capsule or something so nothing to hook a turbo to...
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Re: 1.8 Diesel upgrades

Post by JoeIsuzu »

And the aneroid/altitude compensator is not quite the same as the boost compensator on a turbo pump.

Jack
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